Hi Andrea…yup, out gut instinct is NEVER wrong and don’t ever let a narc or anyone else cast doubt upon this fact!….xo

Hi Ali,

I am so sorry for the situation with your brother. Unfortunately, I am not sure what you can do since she seems to have total control. The medical care aspect is very disturbing. Is there any way at all you can reach out without acknowledging her at all? Maybe by now (since it has been over a month since you wrote), you have already renewed contact with him. I think that and the family will have to rethink your strategy and simply focus on him without mentioning her, know what I mean? My motto is…give them nothing to talk about. By this I mean if you reach out just to see how he is and to say you love and care for him and then take it slow without bad-mouthing her (I know it will be hard), he will have to come around because you won’t be causing that strife. There will be nothing for her to get in the middle of. It’s kind of like tricking him into coming around but under these circumstances, anything goes and all rules are off. Let me know how it goes, my friend….female narcs can be BRUTAL.

Zari xo

Hi JC,

Look, I’ll be the first to say that although every narcissist is a cheater, not every cheater is a narcissist. But four times? This is not good under any circumstances. I’m not a professional counselor but I would have to say that any partner who cheats on his wife (and family) 4 times has definitely got something else up his sleeve. Your husband is obviously not engaging in behaviors that are conducive to him being in a relationship, let alone a marriage, and this is HIS CHOICE. I feel terrible that ANY counselor, upon hearing a story like yours, would even THINK of blaming you – the wife – and I hope you do not take that to heart. This is NOT your fault. Narcissists are very capable of manipulating therapists and do it all the time. This becomes part of the game and this is why a narcissist may even suggest that he and his primary partner go to counseling… just to see if he can get away with it.

To answer your question, I have spoken to hundreds of people and corresponded with literally thousands and I have never heard of a relationship surviving when one partner is a serial cheater. The truth is that…why should it survive? Why should your husband be allowed the privilege of having his family and multiple affairs too. This must be horribly painful for you but since he has repeatedly gotten away with it, there is no incentive for him to even try to stop doing it. If he’s a narcissist (which I dare say he is because of the cheating but would like to know more), then you allowing him to stay is his free pass to continue the fun. Moreover, you’ve had the unfortunate experience of having a counselor basically enable the situation by blaming you which is really really awful. Do NOT believe that nonsense.

No one wants divorce because divorce is painful under 98% of circumstances but how much can one person take? If you feel up to it, consider booking a little time with me and perhaps we can figure it out. I’d be more than happy to give you my honest opinion either way and share some experiences and what insight I do have and maybe this will brings things into focus. You are not doomed to be the betrayed wife for the rest of your life. You obviously care about your family very much and I can see that. I imagine your husband is very manipulative, convincing, and even charming and I’d like to know if he AGREED with the counselor’s opinion that it was you. This would be very telling of the situation.

Take care, sister and I am sorry for your troubles.

Zari:)

Have you ever seen a couple make it out together and the behavior stop? We have two teenage children and have been married 15 years, and divorce is not something I really want.

The next day I met up w him and he told me he had missed me so much the night before. He said he went to our favorite spot and drank a 6pack of Coronas by himself. I immediately responded w ‘you’re lying to me, what did you really do last night?’ Really caught him off guard and he stammered for a minute hen got mad and said it was typical of me to accuse him of lying.

Flash forward 2 months later. I found out he effed some gremlin looking girl at his job.

You’re right Zari. Always trust your gut instinct no matter how cray it may seem. Don’t put anything past a narc!

Hi Yazoorose,

Wow…I had a Tucson, AZ Guitar Player (the narc of my books and the basis for all these articles!) and guess how I could tell EXACTLY who he was interested in: by taking mental notes of all the girls that “he just didn’t like”. Inevitably, the names of the ones he hated the most (or who ANNOYED him) would always end up in his phone. Imagine that! And he did, in the end, have a thing for MUCH older women when he felt like it. 70 years sounds about right! Yup, they are all the same. I did mine for 13-years. Read my book When Love Is a Lie…you will think that you wrote it:)

Stay strong!

Zari:)

and I was right. He had a big thing for her and she even got drunk at a venue one night and he claims she kissed him and he tried to get away. Everyone else claims they were kissing each other. The times I went to hear him play and she was there…he could barely keep his eyes off her and she always tried to get close to him. She told a friend of hers, who told me, that he was always trying to get her to come hear him play. He never asked me. He liked on all her facebook stuff–he rarely liked on mine.

I was in a 12 year hell hole with this piece of scum. His latest is a nearly 70 year old woman that looks like Alice the Goon on Popeye. When we talk now, it’s always at my instigation. He will say “I almost called you today, but I forgot to”. Yet he still loves me?? Right?? Uh huh. He’s blocked now from everything.

OMG…we all hung out with the same guy, I swear! What typical word garbage! Good God!

He> “Julie says there’s a great new series on TV”
Me> “Who’s Julie?” (a pang of anxiety in my stomach).
He> “Someone I know.” (Smiles silently to himself smugly)
Me> “What do you mean by that?” (Getting more anxious)
He> “A friend.” (Calmly, with a smirk)
Me> “From where?”
He> “Oh, just somewhere.”
Me> “Where?”
He> “Does it matter?”
Me> “Someone you are trying to shag?” (Stomach churning)
He> “That’s not what I said.”
Me> “Well who is she then?” (Upset, on brink of tears)
He> “Just someone I know”. (Totally relaxed and smiling.)
Me> “Where do you know her from? Your street? At work, Where?”
He> “Does it matter?”
Me> “Yes, I want to know if this is yet another woman you are shagging behind my back”. (Tears welling up in eyes)
He> “Why are you getting so upset?” (Calmly)
Me> “Is something going on or what?” (Tears running down face)
He> “Stop being so silly. You are paranoid” (Totally calm) “She’s just a girl in the office. I’ve worked with her for years”.
Me> “Why do you keep doing this to me? Why don’t you just tell me right at the start who Julie is? Why do you deliberately string me along until I am in a state?” (Bursts into tears of relief that *this time* it isn’t someone he is having a secret affair with.)
He> (Shakes head slowly and speaks calmly and reasonably.) “I can’t believe you can get so worked up over a girl’s name. You are so paranoid it’s ridiculous. You should just hear yourself sometimes! I’m going home now, you have put me in a bad mood and I just want to be on my own.”

Hi TJP,

I am so grateful that you connected with my website but so sorry that you’ve had to endure all this suffering. What a bastard! Here in the states (and at least in Arizona), it’s easy enough to get a restraining order just by going to a court house and asking for one. Of course, he can contest it but it does keep him at a distance. I can’t believe he was found not guilty even though the police obviously thought it important enough to want to arrest him. That is awful.

Yes, my most recent article is all about how a narcissist’s break-up never seems real and this is why we continue to take them back almost as if they’ve never been gone. It’s like that part of our life, when they disappear, gets put in suspended animation – frozen in time – along with our feelings. I understand how horrible it is. We spend most of the relationship addicted to the very drama that we hate…addicted to the hope and the suffering. We don’t want to let go of any of it! But, as we know, we absolutely MUST let go or else we will waste the rest of our life trying to no avail.

I am going to go to my personal email right now and send you my books in PDF. I’ll send them to the email address you used to write your post. If you don’t see it there, check your SPAM folder. I believe they will help you as well and they go into much detail about my own relationship and how I mentally broke free even before it REALLY ended for good. And if it’s ever possible for you, I do provide consultations via phone and I speak with people in the UK all of the time. There is also a really cool support group in the UK – The London Narcissist Abuse Support Group – or something like that. They just opened up a second chapter in Manchester I believe.

You are right to go No Contact and to stay quiet even if he smears you. You can’t defend against idiocy and the very fact that you say nothing puts you in the better light. As for your daughter, you are doing everything right there as well. Let him dig his own parental grave as narcissist’s typically will do. Just be there for her and know that you are doing the best that you can. Have no guilt, my sister! How could you have possibly known? There’s is no way to see it coming if you’ve never experienced it – no way – and sometimes it takes a physical event to end it.

Thank you for writing such a heartfelt letter…I appreciate you. It makes my own experience all worth it to be able to give comfort to someone else in this same damn boat. Recovery is a team effort:) LOOK FOR THE BOOKS – THEY WILL BE ON THE WAY IN TWO MINUTES.

Zari xo

Hi Break through,

Right on! You did the absolute right thing. Now. run with that feeling and never look back. Time is too short to waste on these fools…

Zari xo

Zari, thank you. Today almost a month now I feel like I’m going to be okay. Gathered all the reminders of him, clothing, mementos, souvenirs, cards, etc. placed them all in a bag and tossed it in the garbage can. Even erased all voice mail messages. Finally feeling nothing at all, no sorrow. Actually feel free of his invisible hold on me.

Hi Dumbfounded,

Go back to NC and pretend that what just happened never happened. He is never going to change…not for you, not for anybody. Cut your losses now before it’s way too late. We only have one life and we waste enough time loving monsters who can’t love us back. It just isn’t worth it…not even for the few good memories that they give us. Stop accepting crumbs. Block his ass once and for all and go find the happiness that you deserve. I’m here if you need me, sister…

Zari xo

Thank you for writing and I am grateful that you feel safe. However, maybe I am misunderstanding, but it sounds like you still speak with him. If so, to him, he’s perfectly happy that way because it is keeping you in the queue. Every day, all day, everything a narcissist does is about what he can get away with. If he can have a new girlfriend and complain to you about it, he basically got away with it. Of course, he is going to make it sound as if it’s nothing that he wants to be in but the truth is that no one is forcing him to stay in a relationship. This is why NC is so important. In order for you to move on, not allowing him to call whenever he feels like it to get a sympathetic – albeit neutral – ear would be a good start. I know it’s hard and at least talking to him doesn’t seem as painful as not talking to him at all…I get that. But it never works. Just beware of the intention on your end…we already know what his intention is. Narcissists are so clever…we think we’ve won and that we have things under control and then we get blindsided. He’d be in even more of a mess if you blew him off and that’s exactly what he deserves.

Good luck and stay strong!

Zari xo

Deanna,
Be assured that he is treating the other woman the same way. If you know who she is and how to contact her, I would let her know what he is doing, woman to woman. There is a comradery between men having each other’s back even when they don’t know each other; however, women tend to place other women as ‘the enemy’ or feel as though they will appear as the ‘jealous bitch’ if they approach them with the truth…it’s all in how you handle it…but, ‘the truth shall set you free’, and possibly someone else. You have nothing to lose Good luck!

Deanna, I hope Zari had a consultation with you. For what it’s worth, my own two cents is that he is NOT as happy as he pretends to be with this other woman. If he’s so happy with her, then why is he spending so much time and energy on YOU? The time he’s spending constantly going after you, is time he’s taking away from quality alone time with HER. If she makes him so happy, then you’d think he’d want to spend all his time with her and not spend any of it on you.

I have never known any NORMAL person, in a truly happy relationship, who gloats about it to exes. EVER. They just move on and go on their merry way with their partners. I speak from personal experience now that I really am in a happy relationship. I just spend my time with my guy, and can honestly say that I have not told any exes about my engagement, gloated about it, rubbed it in etc (and that includes the narcissist). Why? I no longer care, whatsoever, what they think or feel. So I don’t see it being worth the time or effort to contact them. If he were truly that happy, he wouldn’t bother making the effort to get a rise out of you.

Deanna, I know it’s hard to get through the anger and all the emotions, but try to remember that it’s all an illusion.

What a fantastic analogy Zari! That is so true. In all this time, I really did have the power to have the loving relationship I wanted–by listening to those inner alarm bells, setting healthy boundaries for myself and not accepting anything less. I just had to discover that power.

I’m living proof of exactly what you said. By ending things with the narcissist, I sent out a message to the universe that I will NOT tolerate passive-aggressiveness any longer, and that I want someone who treats me with the respect I deserve. Then surely enough…a few months later I got my reward, a great guy who truly does respect and cherish me. At the time (and for months after) I didn’t know that my REAL soulmate was in the wings–and that being with him would be far more fulfilling than the manufactured fake “soulmate” the narcissist pretended to be. Once I did get my reward, it was even better than I could have imagined, because it’s based on something real. Everyone here has a better reward waiting, but you’ve got to first unshackle the narcissist’s chains. Everyone here, keep the faith!

Hi Christine,

Oh we know it means more but SHINY AND BEAUTIFUL IS FRIGGING AWESOME! Congrats, sister, and thank you for sharing. As always, you offer hope and proof that life exists beyond the rabbit hole if we only allow ourselves to get there. Our gut feeling is ALWAYS RIGHT. It’s all about that little voice that we all hear and often ignore. Everyone speaks of it because it is very real and it is THERE FOR A REASON. It doesn’t always tell us what we want to hear but too bad – if we ignore it, nothing good EVER happens.

You listened to your gut instinct and it eventually brought you a reward – a KEEPER! The Universe gave us INTUITION as a guide to all the right things and as a big warning bell against the bad. If we listened to it as often as it spoke to us, we’d all breeze through life but humans are driven by emotions and it is often after the fact that we heed the message. Again, the voice doesn’t always tell us what we want to hear but the truth is that if we take the warning, the reward, even if not immediate, will be beyond what we could possibly imagine at the time. We must believe this.

I always think of the scene from The Wizard of Oz in the very end between Dorothy and The Good Witch, Glenda. Dorothy is heart-broken, feeling she has lost all chance of ever getting back to Kansas. Glenda listens for a minute and says something like, “Oh Dorothy…silly girl…you’ve always had the power to go back to Kansas. You’ve had it all along”. “Why didn’t you tell me???” Dorothy asks, shocked. “Because you wouldn’t have believed me,” Glenda replies. “You had to find out for yourself.” No one can do this for us but us. Our power is in our REACTION to the narcissist’s behaviors. We have complete control over that whether we know it or not. It has always been within our power thanks to that little voice that we have to learn to listen to.

Congrats, Christine! I am so grateful that you keep returning to share the happy ending…

Zari xo

Hi Deanna,

My God girl….you better book a consultation. I don’t know what else more to say in a written response post. This has got to stop. He’s getting to you because you’re allowing it to happen. We can’t control the behaviors of narcs, but we CAN control our reactions to it. In that, we have a whole lotta power. He is wasting you life away with this push-pull bullshit. NO MORE!!! Together, we’ve got to work on some ways to re-train your brain. Talking about it has miraculous results. Check out the talk packages and choose what works for you. It’s time to make a change or this will continue to happen until the end of time. He is an absolute douchebag who KNOWS how to get under your skin. You deserve better!!!

Much love,
Zari

I started coming here in Ocotober 2014. I had 17 years of misery and counting. He just want leave me alone and he is dating a much younger woman so why fuck with me. After 17 years he is pulling my heart strings with the love bombing hell I don’t know what.

I can’t take this shit anymore because I am thinking some horrible thoughts wanting to do something to him. He is continuing to make me miserable and I keep telling myself he is crazy. If he is so happy now why continue to find a way to get at me with his bullshit. These are the questions I’m asking myself. Oh he says it the 17 now 18 year history. He made me for him even though he gone on to fuck up someone else’s life, mine, head etc.

I’m not with him at all but he hounds me constantly with this new supply that he has in his life.

Zari I’m angry because I can’t shake this asshole.

Thank you but I need the one on one so much until I could scream and I will do it in the near future.

I come and read out here I just haven’t posted lately thank you for your website because this is the only way for me. I know no other way but I tell you I need him continuing to find a way to get at me with his new woman and his bullshit. I hate him so much because he fucked my head up and I’m trying my best to go on and deal with it but my Narc keeps fucking with my head and mind with this 38 year old

Thank you for listening I apolgize for ranting and probably not making any much sense.

Deanna
I’m frustrated with myself because I know what I’m dealing with.

That is such a great comment. You’re right, there really IS no good purpose served by waiting around for “factual proof” or an “aha” moment. Even the sinking feeling and suspicions feel bad enough, why make it even worse by actually catching the narcissist in the act? Your gut instinct is all the real validation you need, to leave.

I actually did something kinda crazy to try to get “proof”. I actually hunted through craigslist personal ads to try to find him and catch him in the act of trying to lure in other women! There was one particular ad that really stood out to me and really sounded just like him. When I read it, my heart just sank. Now, I can’t definitively prove it was really him behind that pseudonym, but it wouldn’t shock me if it was.

However, I ultimately decided it wasn’t worth my time and energy to try to link it to him.
Thankfully, my better instincts took over and I wondered, WTF am I doing, combing through sleazy ads, and playing amateur sleuth??? It’s something that I NEVER normally do at ALL. Just the fact that I was suspicious enough to have done a thing like that was enough for me…I decided, I didn’t need a final nail in the coffin proving it was him. I decided to just walk away from the nonsense, once and for all, and try to keep my dignity.

A trustworthy person, like my fiancee, doesn’t invoke suspicious feelings in you and make you want to play “detective”. If you ever even feel like amateur sleuthing, get out! And for goodness sakes, leave detective work to actual detectives!

I started off with that to give people hope that there IS life after the narcissist! However, to get to this happy place now, I had to let go of my unhappy one with the narcissist first. Towards the end, I kept getting that sinking feeling that the narcissist was sleeping with other people and laughing at me behind my back, even while smiling to my face. I can’t even verbalize the agony of the final, week long silent treatment, but I will just say I wouldn’t even wish it on my worst enemy. Eventually, I got tired of all these toxic feelings I was experiencing and decided, enough was enough. I sent one final, dispassionate text breaking things off with him. I also immediately blocked his phone number, to not give him any opportunity to reply. I’m still proud of myself for turning the tables on the narcissist to give HIM a silent treatment…forever.

In hindsight, that is one of the best decisions I ever made. If I hadn’t left, that stupid passive-aggressive, “I love you, I hate you” dance would have stolen way too much time away from me. I didn’t have any concrete, “smoking gun” type of evidence of the cheating, but just moved on my gut instinct. That little voice inside you will never steer you wrong. It is not arbitrary, but is always there for good reason. I have NEVER heard from it again with my fiancee (well, because he DOES tell me the truth, so I never feel like he’s lying to me). We all just need to trust ourselves that those sinking feelings are nature’s warning signal to protect us from further harm. Even if people don’t remember anything else from this website, at least remember that! Keep the faith and keep strong!