Hi Andrew…no, not every hoover is meant to rekindle. A narcissist really doesn’t care if he or she is with you physically as long as they’re in your head. The pictures were meant to do just that…get back into your head…and it worked. She simply wanted to see if she would get a reply…and she did…and after that, it was on. The reason it was so nasty is that your reply to the picture was very casual and you didn’t even sign it. I would have preferred you ignored it but next to that, you did it right. THAT’S what annoyed her and so she confirmed for you what a bitch narc she really is…not that you needed confirmation. Best thing is to forget it happened, laugh it off, throw away or delete the pics and keep moving. It only takes you back a few steps if you allow it. She may reach out again, this time with an apology for being mean or whatever. It means nothing. Don’t over analyze AND DON’T ENGAGE EVER AGAIN IN ANY WAY.

Hi Jim,

I’ve written an article for the guys on this website which explains – and apologizes for – the gender reference. Search for “Male Victims” in the search at top to find it. Since I am a girl and my narc was a guy and I write from and about my own experience, the gender is going to be “he”. That’s the only reason. Personally, I think the female narc is the worst of the worst!

xo

I would love some advice. I am certain that i was in a realationship with a narc i need a second some advice. Long story…….. My narc reached out to me via facebook we used to go to school together. He has 2 children and advised me that he and his kids mother were no longer together and he wanted nothing but to co-parent with her. The love bombing was so intense and quick after about 2 weeks he was telling me he loved and by 1 month he moved in and at 2 months he moved myself and my children to a house. He begged me to quit my job stating i no longer needed it he would make sure the kids and i were ok. We talked about marriage constantly planned for our future talked about buying houses the whole 9. I thought he was my soulmate as he so kindly stated all the time. He loved to say i was the female version of him. Our relationship started in Jan. By April I started to realize that something was still going on with him and the kids mother. I questioned him he yelled at me which he never did and said he was going to leave. We somehow made up but things did not go back to normal. He tells me he is leaving and will be back after a month he needed some space and he would still pay the bills and come see me until he comes home. Well the day he was supposed to leave it turned into a diaster. He waited til I wasnt home and took our dog he bought for me and the kids the tv he got me and lef the house a mess. I came home in the middle and ruined it saw he and his friends jump in the car and pull off right in front of me. I go in and discover all the things gone and my precious dog and all her stuff gone. He left me and the kids no money and i had nothing. I was devestated never been treated this way in my whole life. He blocked my number i was reduced to reaching out to him thru social media. 3 days later he had his uncle to call and so called check on me and said he was going to bring money and never did. A week later the uncle calls again saying he really wanted to talk to me and apologize for how he left. Mind you i still had our dogs certification paper he didnt get everything when he left cause i came home. He left may2 right before his birthday and by may 7th his kids mother was flaunting them on Facebook. Needless to say he moved back in with her his plan the whole time. They were out shopping at espensive places meanwhile me and my kids were high and dry. May 14 mothers day 2017 he reached out to me via a long text. Apologizing saying how much he missed me and wanted to come home. So i slowly let my gaurd down to try and save face with the kids mom cause I was humiliated and i needed money. So after that day he was coming to see me daily and bringing money for us. Kept promising to come home. He was gone for a total 1 month and 3 weeks. At one point while he was gone he went silent on me for a week because I called him out and asked why he was still there with her if he wanted to come home to me. So june 28th he came back home. Prmomised it would never happen again. That he loved me and i never had to worry about her again. I wanted and did believe him for whatever reason. Shortly after his return home his kids mother started posting sublimal messages on FB and i saw ofcourse. indicating that they were still sleeping together. I confronted him about it he flew in a rage and hit me so hard in my face i was in shock. I had never seen this side of him before. This dynamic continued for the next few months she continued taunting me and he was lying and trying to make me seem crazy and the kids mother childish and petty and jealous. He would abuse me everytime I mentioned him cheating he has literally pulled my hair out from the root. He would then go so calm and even comfort me when he was back to normal. By Nov the truth had come out I found out not only was he sleeping with her the entire time but also done so in my car and while i had thier children. He had her thinking he paid no bills becuase by this time i was back working. I had shared with him that i had a fear that he would leave like he did the first time i would come home from work and he would be gone. At work I had so much anxiety i couldnt even concentrate I knew he was lying but he was so convincing that i was being insecure but my intution is so strong i knew he was lying and couldnt prove it. He would beat me to prove that he wasnt cheating and then come to find out everything i accused him of was infact true. So i asked him to leave. He then started calling me all kinds of names talking really nasty to me like never before and refused to leave. After 2 days he finally left for 2 nights. Texted me at 4 am one of the nights and i ignored it. Sunday night rollls around and we texted all night. I then packed all his things and had it sitting out waiting for his return. I went to work. He then starts telling me how mch he loved me and that we would get thru this i advised we wouldnt. When i came home all his things were unpacked and back in the closet. He pleaded with me for 2 weeks to forgive him even cried first time i saw that. Well my son got sick and had to stay home Nov 28 2017 and i left him there with this man. I called checked on him he was stated he was fine and playing. He was telling me he loves me. I get a call from the daycare around 115 that day asking me when i was coming to get my son cause he couldnt be there sick. I was so lost. I explained he is not there he is home. I call him he does not answer. I rush to the daycare and then home. To find him gone all of his things some of mine. He went so far as to take the bed the bed that he threw my brand new one out for . He left me on the floor. He took our new washer and dryer and replaced it with the kids mother old dirty set. And wouldnt take my calls. He didnt give my son and medicine or didnt even feed him while i was gone. Blocked me on all social media. I am friends with his sister and had become really cool with his family who were all in shock. Couple days later i spoke to kids mother he had told her all kinds of horrible things about me as he did the oppisite of her. I couldnt believe it. She posted 3 weeks later thier family pics on Facebook and has since posted tons of taunting things on social media. Bare in mind she has been dealing with him for 10 years and from what i was told he has gone so far as to sleep with her first cousin and she still stayed with him. I have not heard a word from him. Mid Jan I noticed he unbloced me on IG because I had a video up that kept getting viewed. And checked to see if he had unblocked me and he had. I left him unblocked thinking he was going to see me happy and hoover which personally I dont know why i wanted him to i just couldnt believe he threw me and my children away like thrash. After living with us almost a year. Finally he met with his mother who had been at odds with him about the situation and other horrible things he had said about her. I exposed the truth to her and his sister from the abuse and all. he had began his smear campaign saying i would get drunk and beg him and cry whe n he wanted to leave me and leave my kids with him. So he had to leave that way basically saying i was obbsessed with me. Lies all lies he slandered my name. So once i heard of this i went and blocked him on IG. I was devestated i thought its now been 2 months maybe he feels bad but nope he didnt its been a little over 2 months now. and i feel lost. IS he now going to marry her? They have been laghing at me this whole time? Is he not a narc and just a creep? But all this stuff lead me here. Will he leave her again and do this to another woman. Was this the final discard and i should not expect a hoover? Please help !

Travis has not experienced what I have,thank you Zari,your insight and knowlege shaved years of grief from my life.

Mcm wrote…I think that if you’ve experienced narc abuse, going NC and staying NC is the greatest gift you can give yourself. Of course, not all of us can do this, especially those who need to co-parent with a narc. But I believe that even limited contact can do wonders for one’s well-being.

Amen to that!!! So true, so true…..

He pulled the selective memory card, sending a very casual, seemingly inconsequential message with no acknowledgement of our history. Deactivated my account on the spot.

I think that if you’ve experienced narc abuse, going NC and staying NC is the greatest gift you can give yourself. Of course, not all of us can do this, especially those who need to co-parent with a narc. But I believe that even limited contact can do wonders for one’s well-being.

Hi Travis,

First of all, the word is “hoovering”, not “hovering”, and it pertains to a specific behavior of narcissistic partners so my “so-called definition” is not one that I made up…it just is what it is. In other words, my so-called definition is the ONLY definition and what I describe as the behavior is spot-on. Anybody who has ever been involved with a narcissist understands what “hoovering” means, Travis, and if they don’t, they have an “a-ha” moment as soon as they read my article. This is exactly why I write my articles….to give information so those who are dealing with this shit can understand what’s going on. And you know EXACTLY what I’m talking about, right? Right.

Since you don’t say what brought you to my website in the first place, I can only assume that 1) you are a trolling for another website, or 2) you are a narcissist who feels basically “called out” by the words that you’ve read here. Thus, your snarky, illogical way of thinking. My ex (the narcissist) was fascinated by his own disorder as well so I recognize it. I’ve been doing this a long time and, believe me, your intention shines through. Save yourself further embarrassment and move along as your contribution clearly isn’t for the better good of those who come here for support.

Zari

That is just about the most ridiculous and absurd description of something that you very much just generally applied to your own relationship gone bad, making only one thing true about only one of you (you & your ex).. Trying to get back with people you’ve had a bad break-up or relationship with is relatively normal. People get lonely and, so, if there was ever anything good, sometimes it’s just a human thing to go back to the familiar & comfortable, because at some point, even that feels better than being alone, being consumed with pain & misery. You also act as though Narcissism is something that specifically identifies types of people who are all literally the same in thought and action, which is ridiculous. Lots of people exhibit those traits, especially in, during & after relationships. It’s like you could apply these things to anyone after having had their worst day or after having been in a horrible relationship. But you can’t, because the only truth is that you have a victim mentality and are likely the person also exhibiting the narcissistic traits. You can’t get enough of it, because that’s your role – not the one you get to blame on someone else to sell a book. And hovering. Jesus, your so-called definition of that and the tactics, examples, etc. made me laugh harder than I have in quite some time. Those were all like pretty much the most common texts that anyone could’ve and probably has sent to someone at some point or another. You can’t just throw a bunch of interesting topics out that you have no real grasp of or date on etc. and rely solely on the fact that a lot of people will simply choose to buy into it, and your book, so they can justify their own pains, etc., become victims themselves, perpetually, and apply all guilt upon the lover who left them with the biggest scar… Because that’s what you’re doing with all of this garbage – and that makes you the abusive ‘narcissist’ and anyone who pathetically buys into this your victim, as you’re doing nothing more but preying on weakness. Otherwise you’d not have to write long, detailed essays to describe and hopefully promote/sell your BS. Good luck with that though.

Dear littlevoice,

What a sticky situation. Well, the best way to debunk a narcissist’s smear campaign is to stay very, very quiet. This way, no matter what he says, how much shit he talks, your silence casts doubt on his story. The good news is that you really DIDN’T have an “affair” affair so you aren’t/weren’t technically lying when confronted by others. I imagine the whole thing has been very embarrassing and since it’s not really still ongoing, I’m not so sure if I would keep bringing it up to the Board and pushing the issue unless you truly felt you might get the boot. It sounds as if you have a very high position in the Theater Company…one that can’t be easily replaced…so maybe you should take it in stride. This guy obviously has a reputation that precedes him. You mention that he already has not only a wife but a long term mistress as well so you can hardly be faulted for what has happened.

As for him hoovering, he may because narcissists have no shame at all but when and if this happens, you will have to document it but completely ignore it. I wouldn’t worry about it. There’s nothing that can come of it if you don’t allow it. Please let me know how this turns out. I will be curious!

Zari:)

Over the course of 8 months, we never got to the point of a sexual relationship though he cryptically would tease me that it was coming if I had patience and followed the ‘rules’ that he would issue to me via subtext and through song choices (he has had many mistresses in the past). During the Devaluation Phase, he was preparing me for the Discard with songs about affairs/relationships ending and learning how to ‘Hide Your Feelings’. He, myself, and his wife were all working together in the Theatre Company 4 days a week so it was all very risky.

I questioned the nature of our relationship via text stating that I felt like I was being pushed and pulled, he touched me in a way that was subtle but intimate, there was flirtations, and we were messaging each other late into the nights where the next day at the Theatre he would act like I didn’t even exist to him. I asked him to clarify if we ‘were friends or not friends’ because I couldn’t handle being lead up a garden path and all the confusion.

That night, at reheasals, he approached me and tried to completely gaslight me, saying my attentions were ‘unwanted’ and that I needed to stop! I mirrored and became aggressive back saying it ‘WAS unwanted’ and HE needed to stop! He cancelled my lessons, I became distressed, we were both pulled into separate meetings with our Theatre Company Committee and were individually advised that there are rumours we were having an affair and now there is animosity. We both denied this but my discomfort and distress grew, I was messaging him every 3 days to please talk to me and acknowledge me. He then vilified me to the Board members of the Music Conservatorium (that he runs) and the Theatre Committee stating; that I was harassing him, and sending him constant texts. He started to CC the Committee and the Board into our emails where I fell right into his ‘stalker’ trap. I requested a meeting to discuss the professional implications of recent events with him and stated I felt harassed, to this email I received a reply from the Vice President (honorary solicitor) of the Conservatorium drafted up as an illegal mock AVO in which he CC’d in my Theatre Company Committee, the entire Board and Admin staff of the Conservatorium, his wife, and his long term mistress.

I have taken legal action back at him and we are currently in a position for me to receive an apology for the ‘lawyer’ about the fake AVO and defamation…. and an apology from the Narcissist for his inappropriate behaviour with me as a student, substantiated by text messages from him that I have as proof that I am not a stalker and in fact an upset woman trying to preserve her career in the local music industry.

I guess what I’m getting at is; I’ve been reading about Hoovering, and he does Hoover (I’ve seen it) but, given the public and very FINAL nature of my Discard I don’t believe I will be Hoovered. Is this naive? If there is a Hoovering I fear it will be Malign

Hi LALA land,

Contact me here and I will write back and then you will have my personal email:)

xo

– victim of N

Hi Sheilah,

Of course, I can’t make an assumption on the little information you’ve shared but ranting about world politics does not a narcissist make. I rant and lecture about world politics too but that’s because there’s plenty to rant about. It’s a sick political world out there and some people care a whole lot about it. I’m sure that for those who don’t care or who prefer to be asleep to it, those who rant about it can seem quite annoying. I get that. But I would hope the behaviors go beyond that if you feel he should be labeled narcissistic and please do write and share more if you feel up to it and I’ll respond accordingly.

And never “feel terrible” for loving your own son, no matter what his issues are. That’s always going to be there – the love. You can’t do a whole lot about that. The husband though…that can be a whole other story! LOL

Zari:)

What if…..your ex husband is a narcissist and so is your son? He’s 32 years old! I feel terrible for loving him so much and hating the shit out of his bullshit. He is my only son and I just avoid any real communication and let him rant and lecture about the world and politics, etc. I can’t stand it!

What great advice to share with Jo and everyone….thank you! I know all too well about those lost ten years…xo

Have someone else come and pick up the mail if you can, do not let him know where you live if he doesn’t already. I was with a narc for 10 years and he kicked me out after I ended things. This is not so much a hoovering tactic. This is still the “discard” phase. It hasn’t really been long enough for “hoovering”. Hoovering will come many months later when it doesn’t work out with whoever he’s left you for (I promise you, there is someone else in the picture). I was already dating someone else two months after the breakup and my ex did the exact same thing. “I need to drop off your important mail, tell me where you live”. Not only that, he had to the nerve to actually open my mail (a federal offense, thank you very much) to tell me, “You have a really big bill from the tax department”. Narcissists relish in your anguish. Know this and never go back. I made that mistake 5 times and left him 5 times. I lost what should have been the 10 best years of my life. The person I dated after him is a closeted homosexual who also started with the same kind of abuse. Be very, very careful who you let into your life after this experience. Until you come to terms with what has happened to you you are at risk of having another narcissist come swooping in to feed on the leftovers. They have a sixth sense for the perfect “supply”. If I can give you any comfort at all I would say this: Narcissists seek out women who are strong and talented. They do this to showcase themselves and will try to hijack any of your friends in the process. You are traumatized right now. The person you fell in love with simply does not exist….you created him in your mind and he simply mirrored that.

Zari,

So after the “mail” ordeal he got really nasty and was telling me to return his key and treating me like a total pos so I blocked him. Then a few days later l had multiple people tell me he is now plastered all over FB and IG in a “new relationship” after 4 weeks of me moving out!!! He dated this girl years ago for a few months when he was going through his divorce. They never got to really know each other. Anyway all of his family is congratulating them on social media. I feel like I’m in the Twilight Zone.

Hi Jo,

Yes, of course this is hoovering. Block his email – and all of his phone and cell numbers for that matter. He will try to suck you back in just so that he can hurt you again. This is what they do. This is who they are. Do not fall for the ruse. You did the right thing by leaving and laying low. He shouldn’t be allowed to contact you at all.

Zari:)

After several months the devalue, criticizing, verbal/emotional abuse began and I found myself constantly walking on eggshells trying to please him. Nothing I ever did was good enough and he continually raised the bar. I was paying the bills, meeting all his needs, working full time, and yet he always complained about something I wasn’t doing right. Would throw temper tantrums and give me the silent treatment. I never knew what was going to set him off. Yet all of this was peppered with moments of intense love, passion, great sex, and tears from him. I isolated myself from family and friends, my social life became almost non existent, and I was turning into a shell trying to make him happy. I didn’t want to be abandoned and I tried harder at this then in my own marriage. I am divorced.

My N kicked me out after 2 years in January so I hired a moving company and left when he was at work. I deleted social media and went no contact. He recently emailed me on a Friday night after a month of no contact saying he has some “important” mail of mine and would like to know how I want to get the mail.

Is this hoovering?

Hi evilipendiosocial (what a moniker!),

So sorry that you are going through this. It is clear to me that this girl is a narcissist and women narcs are the worst of the worst. Nothing you could have done would have changed the outcome. Do not feel an iota of guilt for the message on the mirror or anything else you may have said or done because this is how they make us feel! The good person that we love and the narc persona are as different as night and day. There was no way for you to have known!

As for justice or closure, unfortunately it never happens. We have to make our own closure by realizing what they are and that they will never ever change. Narcissists KNOW right from wrong, my friend, they just don’t give a shit – and thats the truth. Everyone she meets gets treated exactly the same way. She had no problem wasting your time and making you feel that awful sense of betrayal. They do what they want in the moment with no sense of consequence and without a moral compass. It’s simply horrible and unless a person has experienced the madness for themselves, they will never understand.

I just sent you my book about the female narc (When Evil Is a Pretty Face) from my personal email. I sent it to the email that you used to submit your post so please look for it. I believe it will help you get a handle on exactly what happened. YOU were never the problem, brother, and we are all here to support you:)

Zari xo

I´m in a lot of pain right now. I am an Airbnb host and I had a guest at the start of october 2016. She seemed wonderful, very charming, her laughter was amazingly contagious. We would speak for hours and sometimes even until dawn, I felt I had met an amazing woman whom I had a lot of things in common with, she seemed perfect in fact, my dream woman. I had a girlfriend (5 years relatonship) at the time from whom i moved out ( I left for Spain and she stayed in Denmark – her home town) due to the fact that I was frustrated on many levels (including the relationship). I shared this information with the airbnb guest whom also shared intimate stories about herself (eating disorder, obsession with control, being perfect ) also mentioned she had many failed relationships due to the fact that most men cannot handle a strong independent alpha female like herself. She was having some holiday fling with a guy she met on the street and would constantly tell me about it (i thought it was to make me jealous) but she seemed to be toying around with him a little. She was very flirtracious with me and being good looking I ended up falling for her charm and we had almost spiritual sex. She cried in my arms and told me about this important professional transition she would soon face (leaving a 8 years job to beggin a complete different one) she seemed very fragile, vulnerable and insecure although she portrays a tough woman image. I am a transexual male (have gone through all stages in my transition – and am now 29 years old). I decided to share my personal story with her just to see her reaction and because I wanted her to really get to know me (it took a lot of guts). She cried and told me she could not imagine the amount of pain I must have gone through and told me she was surprised of not being surprised at all. I was deeply moved by her reaction and really thought hey! I found someone really special here. When she had to return I went with her to the airport, from this day on she would text me everyday and call me at least 3 times a day and Skype on the evening. She would tell me I had changed her life, I was her miracle, that one day she would be perfect because she had me. That she missed me and wanted to see me, she told me she desired me, that we had a soul connection and it was beautiful. She even told me she would like to live with me in Copenhagen next year, as I felt stuck in my relationship with my now ex, I felt the most honest thing to do was to break up with her so i could freely pursue what was happening with this other girl. We made plans for travelling, even booked a hotel to spend new years eve together, I sent her 2 postcards and she invited me to Poland.
She frequently made comments on men admiring her beauty and sometimes even sent me a picture of a waiter who called her “his queen” – I thought this was odd.

I wanted to show her i appreciate reality more than fantasies and went to Poland. From calling me “handsome” “darling” “honey ” etc from one day to the next, literally just 1 day before me travelling, she changed. She had even asked me if i wanted to meet her best frend some days ago, to which I replied I would think about it and she insisted until i agreed and said yes. (this whole thing lasted nearly 3 months)
When i got there, she didn´t seem like the same person i met on holidays. She told me to be careful not to get her lipstick on my lips first time i kissed her and saw her, seemed uncomfortable in my presence. We had amazing sex at her place but I still felt something weird was cooking in the air. On the following day she went to work and i even made dinner, she would rant about herself being stressed due to work, stressed with losing weight , stressed because she had to travel the next day (business trip) when i asked for a goodnight kiss she flipped out and told me she was very stressed and told me she was difficult and she could not do something she did not feel like! I was shocked and hurt. She never apologised, on the following day she seemed eager to leave and when she hugged and kissed me it seemed almost forced. She then texted me (nothing like before) simple flight status and telling me when she finally arrived to the hotel. When I replied she saw my messages but decided to ignore me for a whole day. I did not text nor called back, giving her space, she then wrote once more and even colder – finding an excuse on why she was not writing much. I then confronted her and told her that her stress did not justify bad behavior and that she had changed completely in literally 1 day and none of it made sense. She replied she felt awful that she did not feel what she had to feel and knew it was not ok with me. I said I have self respect and know when something is not good for me and i did not deserve such treatment , she said I know you dont deserve it and that is why i feel so sad inside and do not know what to say. I was very hurt and confused so i told her I would change my flight and that i hoped she became better at figuring out her emotions before involving other people. I got no answer, no calls, not even trying to apologise or ask me not to leave until we talked things over, I was there at her flat seeing the same things i saw when we held many skype chats when i comforted her while she cried and told me about her issues (sort of like a life coach). It was devastating to me, I felt used and stupid and to make matters worse in a foreign country. I managed to change my flight on the same day she returned, she had ” Think positively ” with a heart written with lipstick on her mirror and I needed to express my frustration and anger over the fact she did not even spoke to me, I completed this message with ” AND use people to hide who you truly are EMPTY” wrote as well that I was not her fucking joke. ( I am not like this and I am not proud of it now but I did not know how to deal with those horrible feelings). I thought i would have some reaction, some apology, something from her but days passed by (4 days) and i did not get any answer – I was going crazy and decided to write her an sms saying that I was sorry about the way things turned out between us and that hoped she found happiness within herself. She then replied telling me that I was very important to her, that she lived with this thought everyday and memories, when i arrived she felt awful that she did not feel what she should feel. Also said she did not deserve the messages i wrote on her mirror… As I saw this sms i decided to call her, she did not take my call. I explained why i wrote that message and asked her what she thought she deserved? – she then dismissed me by saying ” I am with a friend now”. I then erased her from my phone, facebook, and everywhere. I am still trying to figure out what the hell happened, reading to make sense of things and trying to move on although It hurts a lot – I have come to the conclusion that she must be a covert narcissist or some sort of emotional vampire who obviously used me for emotional security and then for some reason, discarded me. I just wanted to share my story with you to hear your opinion – I am also longing for some sort of closure or sense for justice, since she has not even apologised to me after what she put me through.

Thanks1!